- cross-posted to:
- degoogle@discuss.tchncs.de
- cross-posted to:
- degoogle@discuss.tchncs.de
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I dunno. Milk can age into cheese if done right.
I’d say it aged like a badly discarded biohazard container.
Aged like a used condom
Well that aged like milk. Google is primarily an advertising company now.
Aren’t they super into chatbots tho?
I’m really happy with Kagi but I’m scared its price might go up and I’d want them to really not depend on the GAFAM. I think their results or something is still coming out of these bad companies…
Yep. Last I looked, they used both GAFAM and their own infra (teclis)? I think the goal is to eventually move solely to their own infra / web indexing.
Tbh, I dunno how much longer “search” is going to be a unique category. I think we’re probably going to need to move to personal AI fetch tools, as grim as that sounds, that can filter out shit news sources using trusted domains, white lists / black lists, as blockers etc. Think like ublock but for search.
I think that’s how lots of people use ChatGPT tbh; I’m not a fan of that. I’d favour a more local / self hosted AI agent. Something like Perplexica?
https://github.com/kiranz/perplexica
Actually, fuck it: maybe I’ll build that myself.
The surface web is cooked / enshittified almost beyond use and we might need to fight fire with fire.
maybe if it was a one time purchase.
I hear you - a one off purchase (or a $50-100 for 5yrs) would be a selling point. Hell, I’d even buy credits like I do for USENET.
https://stephango.com/quality-software
Just let me pay in one lump sum. Not a fan of rolling subscriptions; never end up using the whole quota, so unless there’s a rollover it gets wasted.
Self hosted SearXNG is an option but it’s going to be pulling from Bing, Google etc, so the result quality ceiling is capped by those engines. Kagi is trying to be a better search engine overall and not just a private wrapper around existing ones, IIUC.
Personally, I find myself not really searching much any more. I sort of know which sites I need and go there directly. Anything low value goes thru ddg-lite or (gasp) my LLM.
EDIT: Huh…my LLM just told me to sit down
“Kagi supports PayPal and OpenNode (Bitcoin) as alternative payment methods. Crucially, these do not create a subscription. They top off your account with credits, which then fund your Kagi membership. That’s essentially the lump-sum/credits model you described”
Well then…I sit corrected.
i also want to mention Donation based/ads(if not too intrusive) are also fine ig.
and sometimes(depends on country) your only option is monthly subscription (whatever its rent or internet price) you can find for sale buts its like in the millions and i think internet price is monthly only.
but yeah i dislike monthly subscription as much as you(and i agree with you)
i could use a Freemium service that has a monthly subscription too,but i wont buy the subscription. (i may abuse free trials kek)
but obviously i prefer perpetual license the most.
I’m sure old Google didn’t require a subscription.
Because you were the product.
When it was cool to google…
I still remember when Google launched, the uncluttered homepage was the real differentiator, other search engines, especially AltaVista, were just as good at the time, but they would load their homepage with as much extra stuff as they could think of to attract people. Then Google came along with a quirky name (for the time) and a uniquely minimalist look that broke all the established rules, it wasn’t necessarily better search at that point but it really looked different. Different times of course, a search engine was just another website, no different to your own personal page.
As far as I remember Alta Vista was ok at the beginning, but soon people figured out that you can get to the top result if you just repeat your top keywords multiple times in the meta Keywords tag. Another trick was to just add “free, mp3, sex” to each pages meta keywords to get more traffic. At this point Google was better, and also would load much faster on dialup than the image heavy sites like yahoo or Alta Vista.
I liked dogpile back in the late 90s because it would aggregate from several sources and wasn’t terribly cluttered comparatively. I think I swapped to Google around 2000ish because it was so minimalist.
Whoever got rid of “don’t be evil” was a whistleblower if you think about it
I don’t think they got rid of it.
Then your thoughts don’t align with reality.
You seen likely to believe things without doing your own due diligence.
It says it’s still there: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don't_be_evil
Didn’t that happen after people started pointing out their evil?
Not exactly. It sort of depends on your interpretation of events and times.
When the original “Google” turned into Alphabet to split the core Google stuff like search and advertising from all the other side stuff like CapitalG, Waymo, etc. So the entire “Google” corporation as it was, turned into Alphabet. The new Alphabet motto is “Do the right thing.”
The “new” Google subsidiary formed under Alphabet still used the phrase in its Code of Conduct. In 2018 they removed it from the preface, but it’s still the last thing mentioned in the Code of Conduct.
Probably, but basically every big corp has flowery bullshit about improving society or whatever in their mission, so the fact someone at google outright bothered to get rid of don’t be evil was still a pretty big sign
It’s in their contract though, some workers sued for wrongfully being fired after organising based on it.
Up until the 2010s, Google was still viewed as a positive force. Facebook, on the other hand, has pretty much always been viewed as a villain.
“The dumb fucks trust me”
Not sure about getting rid on “don’t be evil” but Prabhakar Raghavan was driver for the enshitification of Google search.
If google were just a search engine still, there wouldn’t be a problem. But they are much much more now. Plus they suck at doing the thing they were supposed to do, i.e. searching.
I read something that said they are PURPOSELY bad at search now because if users have to click multiple pages, they see more ads. Like, how evil do you have to be to purposely corrupt your main thing just to sell more ads.
Well the main thing for them now is to sell more ads…
Search never made them money. Ads do. Ads are their thing.
We need to figure out a way to host content on the web that is just part of the network, without needing servers or big tech companies.
It’s not really possible I know but we need to anyway.
Yup, I know. They are, first and foremost, an advertising company. If they can integrate advertising into their products, you can bet money on them doing so. Which is all the reason i need to never use google again.
Capitalism cannot allow good. Good is not profitable. We must extract, squeeze, enshittify until the very end.
I’d argue ddg is good and they area product of capatalism. Nobody is forcing you to use google
DDG is just Bing in disguise. It’s nowhere near as good as google used to be back in last century.
I use it and I have no problems at all. Would say it’s on the same level, but the ai searches are actual relevant and tasteful unlike google
Anyone using ai searches is automatically un trustable to me. Ive never once needed it and ive corrected many stupid people asking ai things and suddenly thinking they are smart on a subject that I’m actually knowledgeable in because I actually read and use my brain.
Kagi is maybe one aspect of capitalism that works. I pay, I get good product. I know it has a couple bad things (possible Russian ties) but yeah
It’s all about market capture, then anything they want.
Eh, their home page is still very clean, as described in the picture.
