“One of the largest militaries in the world?” Are you actually for real right now?
The US spends more on the military than the next 9 countries combined! Obviously, anyone sane who’s in the US’s crosshairs is going to desperately try to muster whatever military strength they possibly can, for fear of invasion! Which the US has done, not only generations ago before any of us were born, but with a full scale invasion and decades-long occupation in living memory, ending only a few years ago! Before going straight into attacking Iran, with no provocation!
Jesus Christ, you imperialists are completely nuts! What is it about militaristic, authoritarian empires that makes you completely abandon any sort of reasoning or common sense, and start acting like a tiny hermit country halfway across the world that hasn’t been in a conflict for 70 years is somehow a threat to the most powerful and militaristic country on earth? It’s completely ridiculous.
Fucking, Rome had more plausible arguments for “defending itself” when they conquered Gaul!
You just keep licking the boot of the US government and accepting every bullshit justification it gives as it expands to every corner of the world, until it collapses on itself from the overextension, until the fascists take advantage of the decline and seize power at home, and when we’re both being matched into the gas chambers, I’ll ask you again whether fucking North Korea was really the threat we needed to be worrying about.
Well, yeah. In terms of numbers. 30% of the population is military. Of course spending isn’t gonna count, North Korea is poor as shit. They don’t have the money for nice things, they just have bodies (in various forms of starvation).
And sure, they can justify it with a fear of invasion. SK also has a justified fear of invasion. Looks like it’s gonna be a pissing match, we’ll see who’s got the bigger dick. Militarily speaking.
Yeah, no shit! You realize that’s a point against you right? I’m the one arguing that North Korea isn’t a real credible threat. That’s exactly why they have to try to make up the difference in manpower! Even South Korea, on it’s own outspends the north.
Did you get distracted by the blood rushing to your dick, thinking about how your empire has a greater capacity for violence, and you lost track of what the conversation was about?
Meanwhile, as all our money is poured into that idiotic nonsense so that people can get their rocks off and so that billionaires can profit off it, roads, infrastructure, healthcare, education, etc decay more and more each year, causing actually real suffering and danger to people’s lives. But who cares? Building hospitals doesn’t let you live out a juvenile power fantasy like setting off bombs and rockets does.
Now the question becomes: is NK going to continue to play a losing hand, or are they gonna do what China did and figure out what they can do to realistically counter US dominance?
Based on the last 70 years, NK appears to be set on continuing to play a losing hand, hoping that one day the US backs down and they’re able to restart the Korean war.
They could pretty easily stop sending 80% of their resources to the military and start improving things for their people. But I don’t think Kim Jong Un wants to do that. Nor do I think the current NK government would be able to survive demilitarization. Not from external threats, mind you. I don’t think their society is gonna put up with Kim very long when there are ways to feed yourself outside the army.
It’s not at all clear that North Korea would be allowed to follow the same path that China did. However, the point is completely irrelevant to the discussion. Again, we are not evaluating the North Korean government or their domestic policy, we are evaluating whether they pose a credible military threat, both in terms of their aims and their capabilities, and the answer to that is a resounding “No,” by your own admission.
In any case it’s incredibly hypocritical to lecture another country about their military spending while the US is spending more than the next 9 countries combined. You can’t pretend that you have some principled commitment towards deescalation if you’re just focused on getting weaker countries to put down their arms so that powerful countries can dominate them. That is just imperialism, plain in simple. You might as well be a British colonizer calling for Zulus to not be so militaristic and to put down their bows and arrows, as they slaughtered them with machine guns.
NK doesn’t pose a credible military threat to the US. It poses a credible military threat to SK. That’s why the US acts as a deterrent.
The difference being: the US can afford to spend that money on the military much easier than NK can. There really isn’t shit to dominate in NK, by modern standards.
NK doesn’t pose a credible military threat to the US. It poses a credible military threat to SK. That’s why the US acts as a deterrent.
Of course, if Rome’s interests are not threatened, then it’s those of Rome’s allies. Nevermind that SK outspends NK on the military, or that the north hasn’t attacked in 70 years.
The difference being: the US can afford to spend that money on the military much easier than NK can.
First off, so what? This is a talking point I always see that makes absolutely zero sense whatsoever, to look at expenditure as a percent of GDP instead of in absolute terms. As if it’s just natural to keep pouring money into the military for no reason, just because you can!
Military expenditure is only justified if it is countering a real, legitimate threat. If a small poor country is threatened by a large rich country, then the small country is of course justified in spending a higher percentage of its GDP on defense, because otherwise it would be completely defenseless. Conversely, to spend not only more than any other country, but more than the next nine countries combined, clearly means that the expenditure has nothing to do with responding to threats. Rather, it is about being a threat, which other countries then have to respond to.
Secondly, I disagree that that the US can more easily spend the money. Because, despite how much richer the US is, it is also trying to hold together a globe-spanning empire through military force. Korea is only one of many theaters that the US is involved in, and what we’re seeing now is that the US is being forced to pull military equipment away from Korea to the Middle East, where it’s once again gotten over it’s head. The money that we spend on trying to dominate Korea also has to be spent on every other imperial project, from Cuba to Iran to Syria and so on.
Because of how massively overextended the US is, it is now $40 trillion in debt, many countries are turning to or at least considering dedollarization, and the US is scrambling to make trade deals more extractive which is causing long-term harm to its alliances. And that’s just internationally! Domestically, the situation is even worse. Trump rose to prominence in a large part because he distinguished himself from the political establishment, both sides of which fully supported the disasterous, failed imperial project in Afghanistan. The far-right has jumped on the opportunity to take advantage of people’e frustrations with all these foreign entanglements, and the declining economic conditions such as inflation, while holding and promoting all kinds of extremist ideas (and while continuing to engage in such projects). The only prominent voices in American politics with a platform to present an alternative are useless liberals who refuse to adapt to the situation in any way, stubborning clinging the same kind of imperialist talking points you’ve said and not addressing people’s actual material needs.
The longer this situation is allowed to continue, the more likely it is that the fascists will seize power, permanently. If you think things are bad with Trump now, you have no idea how much worse the right is capable of becoming, and how much worse they will become. The US, at present, cannot afford to be involved in any conflict abroad. Frankly, I’m not even sure that the US could fix itself if it did drop everything and adopt the correct focus. The core of the empire is in a state of decay and crisis. And while that it happening, it absolutely cannot afford to be preoccupied with anywhere like North Korea, which certainly does not present any kind of existential threat.
Every dollar wasted on pointless military exercises on the Korean peninsula is a dollar that isn’t being spent revitalizing the domestic economy, and if the economy is not revitalized then it is inevitable that the fascists win. Why should I care about this absurd, exaggerated threat on the other side of the world, when there’s an actual, real threat that my next-door neighbors could vote for me to be sent to a camp? It’s delusional, it’s complete and utter nonsense.
Who cares if the empire is maintained and expanded, if it turns full-on fascist?
You’re insane. “Attacked?” A couple scouts wandered across the border. SK fired warning shots and they left. You call that an “attack?”
How many Americans have been killed by police shootings and ICE raids? Those are attacks! When fascists mobs beat trans people to death and the cops look the other way, that is an attack! We are currently under attack, right now. Not an attack 70 years ago, not thousands of miles away, not an “attack” that’s a random soldier with a bad map, but intentional, organized acts of violence, with the intent of establishing a new, oppressive order in the United States itself.
It is beyond unreasonable and just full on delusional to think of anything else but complete and total focus on destroying the one, singlural existential threat that actually exists! They’re at the fucking gates, my dude! They trying to kill us all! And there’s a damn good chance they actually will!
What the fuck is going on in your mind to worry about this non-issue half a world away? A border skirmish? It couldn’t even be called that! Warning shots, fired by South Korea? Are you out of your mind? Fucking hell! Look at what our own government is doing to our own people! I can’t even go to work without thinking what would happen if a bunch of jackbooted masked thugs showed up and started shoving everyone into a van, to be taken to a secret torture dungeon in El Salvador!
Drop everything else. North Korea could be rolling tanks across the border as we speak, and it would still be less urgent then dealing with the fascists here at home! They want us in the fucking ground! What part of that do you not understand? They are an imminent threat to the entire world! North Korea doesn’t give half a shit about us, except to the extent that we fuck with them! How can you have such completely ridiculous, mixed up priorities??
“One of the largest militaries in the world?” Are you actually for real right now?
The US spends more on the military than the next 9 countries combined! Obviously, anyone sane who’s in the US’s crosshairs is going to desperately try to muster whatever military strength they possibly can, for fear of invasion! Which the US has done, not only generations ago before any of us were born, but with a full scale invasion and decades-long occupation in living memory, ending only a few years ago! Before going straight into attacking Iran, with no provocation!
Jesus Christ, you imperialists are completely nuts! What is it about militaristic, authoritarian empires that makes you completely abandon any sort of reasoning or common sense, and start acting like a tiny hermit country halfway across the world that hasn’t been in a conflict for 70 years is somehow a threat to the most powerful and militaristic country on earth? It’s completely ridiculous.
Fucking, Rome had more plausible arguments for “defending itself” when they conquered Gaul!
You just keep licking the boot of the US government and accepting every bullshit justification it gives as it expands to every corner of the world, until it collapses on itself from the overextension, until the fascists take advantage of the decline and seize power at home, and when we’re both being matched into the gas chambers, I’ll ask you again whether fucking North Korea was really the threat we needed to be worrying about.
Well, yeah. In terms of numbers. 30% of the population is military. Of course spending isn’t gonna count, North Korea is poor as shit. They don’t have the money for nice things, they just have bodies (in various forms of starvation).
And sure, they can justify it with a fear of invasion. SK also has a justified fear of invasion. Looks like it’s gonna be a pissing match, we’ll see who’s got the bigger dick. Militarily speaking.
My money is not on NK.
Yeah, no shit! You realize that’s a point against you right? I’m the one arguing that North Korea isn’t a real credible threat. That’s exactly why they have to try to make up the difference in manpower! Even South Korea, on it’s own outspends the north.
Did you get distracted by the blood rushing to your dick, thinking about how your empire has a greater capacity for violence, and you lost track of what the conversation was about?
Meanwhile, as all our money is poured into that idiotic nonsense so that people can get their rocks off and so that billionaires can profit off it, roads, infrastructure, healthcare, education, etc decay more and more each year, causing actually real suffering and danger to people’s lives. But who cares? Building hospitals doesn’t let you live out a juvenile power fantasy like setting off bombs and rockets does.
Yep.
Now the question becomes: is NK going to continue to play a losing hand, or are they gonna do what China did and figure out what they can do to realistically counter US dominance?
Based on the last 70 years, NK appears to be set on continuing to play a losing hand, hoping that one day the US backs down and they’re able to restart the Korean war.
They could pretty easily stop sending 80% of their resources to the military and start improving things for their people. But I don’t think Kim Jong Un wants to do that. Nor do I think the current NK government would be able to survive demilitarization. Not from external threats, mind you. I don’t think their society is gonna put up with Kim very long when there are ways to feed yourself outside the army.
It’s not at all clear that North Korea would be allowed to follow the same path that China did. However, the point is completely irrelevant to the discussion. Again, we are not evaluating the North Korean government or their domestic policy, we are evaluating whether they pose a credible military threat, both in terms of their aims and their capabilities, and the answer to that is a resounding “No,” by your own admission.
In any case it’s incredibly hypocritical to lecture another country about their military spending while the US is spending more than the next 9 countries combined. You can’t pretend that you have some principled commitment towards deescalation if you’re just focused on getting weaker countries to put down their arms so that powerful countries can dominate them. That is just imperialism, plain in simple. You might as well be a British colonizer calling for Zulus to not be so militaristic and to put down their bows and arrows, as they slaughtered them with machine guns.
NK doesn’t pose a credible military threat to the US. It poses a credible military threat to SK. That’s why the US acts as a deterrent.
The difference being: the US can afford to spend that money on the military much easier than NK can. There really isn’t shit to dominate in NK, by modern standards.
Of course, if Rome’s interests are not threatened, then it’s those of Rome’s allies. Nevermind that SK outspends NK on the military, or that the north hasn’t attacked in 70 years.
First off, so what? This is a talking point I always see that makes absolutely zero sense whatsoever, to look at expenditure as a percent of GDP instead of in absolute terms. As if it’s just natural to keep pouring money into the military for no reason, just because you can!
Military expenditure is only justified if it is countering a real, legitimate threat. If a small poor country is threatened by a large rich country, then the small country is of course justified in spending a higher percentage of its GDP on defense, because otherwise it would be completely defenseless. Conversely, to spend not only more than any other country, but more than the next nine countries combined, clearly means that the expenditure has nothing to do with responding to threats. Rather, it is about being a threat, which other countries then have to respond to.
Secondly, I disagree that that the US can more easily spend the money. Because, despite how much richer the US is, it is also trying to hold together a globe-spanning empire through military force. Korea is only one of many theaters that the US is involved in, and what we’re seeing now is that the US is being forced to pull military equipment away from Korea to the Middle East, where it’s once again gotten over it’s head. The money that we spend on trying to dominate Korea also has to be spent on every other imperial project, from Cuba to Iran to Syria and so on.
Because of how massively overextended the US is, it is now $40 trillion in debt, many countries are turning to or at least considering dedollarization, and the US is scrambling to make trade deals more extractive which is causing long-term harm to its alliances. And that’s just internationally! Domestically, the situation is even worse. Trump rose to prominence in a large part because he distinguished himself from the political establishment, both sides of which fully supported the disasterous, failed imperial project in Afghanistan. The far-right has jumped on the opportunity to take advantage of people’e frustrations with all these foreign entanglements, and the declining economic conditions such as inflation, while holding and promoting all kinds of extremist ideas (and while continuing to engage in such projects). The only prominent voices in American politics with a platform to present an alternative are useless liberals who refuse to adapt to the situation in any way, stubborning clinging the same kind of imperialist talking points you’ve said and not addressing people’s actual material needs.
The longer this situation is allowed to continue, the more likely it is that the fascists will seize power, permanently. If you think things are bad with Trump now, you have no idea how much worse the right is capable of becoming, and how much worse they will become. The US, at present, cannot afford to be involved in any conflict abroad. Frankly, I’m not even sure that the US could fix itself if it did drop everything and adopt the correct focus. The core of the empire is in a state of decay and crisis. And while that it happening, it absolutely cannot afford to be preoccupied with anywhere like North Korea, which certainly does not present any kind of existential threat.
Every dollar wasted on pointless military exercises on the Korean peninsula is a dollar that isn’t being spent revitalizing the domestic economy, and if the economy is not revitalized then it is inevitable that the fascists win. Why should I care about this absurd, exaggerated threat on the other side of the world, when there’s an actual, real threat that my next-door neighbors could vote for me to be sent to a camp? It’s delusional, it’s complete and utter nonsense.
Who cares if the empire is maintained and expanded, if it turns full-on fascist?
NK literally attacked SK last year.
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cn85pvv13e8o
That money ain’t no waste. NK is a problem, and keeping enough guns pointed at them that they stick to probing attacks is a good investment.
You’re insane. “Attacked?” A couple scouts wandered across the border. SK fired warning shots and they left. You call that an “attack?”
How many Americans have been killed by police shootings and ICE raids? Those are attacks! When fascists mobs beat trans people to death and the cops look the other way, that is an attack! We are currently under attack, right now. Not an attack 70 years ago, not thousands of miles away, not an “attack” that’s a random soldier with a bad map, but intentional, organized acts of violence, with the intent of establishing a new, oppressive order in the United States itself.
It is beyond unreasonable and just full on delusional to think of anything else but complete and total focus on destroying the one, singlural existential threat that actually exists! They’re at the fucking gates, my dude! They trying to kill us all! And there’s a damn good chance they actually will!
What the fuck is going on in your mind to worry about this non-issue half a world away? A border skirmish? It couldn’t even be called that! Warning shots, fired by South Korea? Are you out of your mind? Fucking hell! Look at what our own government is doing to our own people! I can’t even go to work without thinking what would happen if a bunch of jackbooted masked thugs showed up and started shoving everyone into a van, to be taken to a secret torture dungeon in El Salvador!
Drop everything else. North Korea could be rolling tanks across the border as we speak, and it would still be less urgent then dealing with the fascists here at home! They want us in the fucking ground! What part of that do you not understand? They are an imminent threat to the entire world! North Korea doesn’t give half a shit about us, except to the extent that we fuck with them! How can you have such completely ridiculous, mixed up priorities??