Leaving my therapist last session she told me I should look into what a “low demand lifestyle” was. My first thought was “f u, no???” and my second thought was “okay but how do I actually incorporate these things?”
I would be grateful to hear how folks of all support need levels have incorporated this concept into their lives.
In my particular situation I have a huge amount of autonomy in my life so most of my struggles are from self demands. It’s a lot easier for me to act on demands from others (so long as I agree they are good demands, things that make sense or that I don’t really care about but care about the person asking so I can do it without too much resistance).
Could have mentioned this as a reply to several of the other replies here. Unable to pick which (nor wanting to paste it over and over), I’ll just make this another reply to the original post…
I’ve just watched https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5eHwmW8UsI (Dr Boz interviewing Chase Hughes; “Chase Hughes: Rewire Your Brain & Make Habits Stick”) and it offers several suggestions how to shift things into low demand good habits. :) Could be handy for several of us.
I recently also heard (I forget from where), to accept our instinct, and not cause friction nor lose traction by spinning our wheels going against the easy flow. Like accepting the “demand avoidance” rather than try to remedy it with brute force of will.
How do you accept the demand avoidance though? At times it’s so bad for me that I cry when I try to ask myself to do something that needs to be done?
Cease asking. :) When it gets like that, accept the demand avoidance. It may be a case of finding it easy to do, once no longer asking yourself to do it, or (if you can) even cease seeing it as something that needs to be done. It’s the door that opens with the gentle touch.
It’s not something I’ve mastered yet, by far. Often still getting myself in a tizzy, trying harder, in futility, the harder I try, the greater the demand, the greater the demand avoidance, in annoying feedback loops. But I have experienced this working more than a few times.
It may take more time, more practice, (or maybe I’ll stumble upon a kind of spiritual sublimation at some point) for being able to remember to do this gentle reminder that it’s the door that opens with the gentle touch, and to take the pressure off myself, and that counter-intuitively, if I stop being so demanding of myself, I’ll find it easier to get whatever it is done.
It is subtle, finicky, this counter-intuitive acceptance of avoiding the demand, perhaps most especially when the demands are from ourselves.
Maybe it’s most effective, when accepting the demand avoidance on the demand to overcome the demand avoidance, interrupting the escalating feedback loop of demand.
it’s the door that opens with the gentle touch
Thank you! I think that this can really help me. It’s how my husband gets around it when we divvy up chores and I somehow didn’t think I could do this for myself.
Lol I will share when I figure that part out??? (Also frustration tears solidarity, comrade.)
I keep hearing that emotional acceptance is so important but I have no idea how to get there. Intellectually, I know I need to change my life because things I have tried in the past do not work. The one that is the hardest is to do less. I am a productivity machine!!!
I think the idea behind low demand lifestyle is to remove the demands that aren’t as critical so you can have the energy to tackle those critical demands. I have a lot of baggage around what I should be capable of doing and what “has” to be done and I’m sure that will make some of the changes a lot harder.
I am a productivity machine!!!
And any downtime can feel like wasted time, and dopamine is king and slave driver giving seemingly kind rewards.
But burn out is no fun.
(To be clear, that’s “no fun”. Not merely “not fun”. ~ As in it sucks all the fun out of all the rest of life too.)
A big deep long dive into burn out is a hard lesson to bear… But it has helped me reframe time dedicated to rest and recuperation as its own kind of productivity, eliminating any self (or socially or societally) imposed sense of guilt or shame for not being maximally productive.
what I should be capable of doing
Stress is a killer.
Stress is expectation’s child.
Much less of that the more we learn to stop “shoulding” on ourselves. :)
Thank you! I will try and watch later.
The last sentence is kind of how I am trying to structure my life now, but for all auDHD things. I’ve spent 40 years fighting my brain to make it “normal”. and all it’s done is cause severe burnout…a burnout which doesn’t respond to normal burnout care because - again - not a neurotypical brain 😭
It’s probably going to be a long process but I am hopeful.
:) Yep.
Keep heading mendwards.
That you started this thread’s a great sign.
(And see again my comments elsewhere here about burnout and atrophy recovery.) :)
First thought:
My what? What’s one of those?
Second thought:
Oh, like when I lived off ayurvedic hemp milk I tweaked to provide all required nutrition, for over a decade, >90% of the time? (Or now, simplified keto-carn, or whatever other prior phases (toasted sandwiches, curries, wraps) where I make just the one simple thing for food most days).
Or like how I’m wallowing in mess I can barely recognise is there, failing to get support? :3
I guess I’d need to get my head around the concept more, before I can give a good answer.
Kinda seems like life’s always going to not be “low-demand”, no matter how I respond to my Pervasive Demand for Autonomy. Not enough anyway.
I think this is probably a vent so I’ll start with saying I hope you find something that works for you, comrade.
If you wanted a response to what you shared: I don’t think “low demand” means refusing demands as much as reducing the number of demands because choices have been made in advance and are consistently applied.
Wallowing in mess is actually high demand because you are constantly faced with it and the desire to do something about it, but it’s too overwhelming to start. A low demand approach might look something like deciding what parts actually need to be fixed and what parts are external and unhelpful. For example I read about someone who doesn’t fold their clean laundry. This sounds like torture to me because I need to know where things are, but for them it let them use the energy on other things that might have a higher priority. Years ago I let go of the idea of cooking every day which was a societal expectation. I still cooked all my own meals largely from basic ingredients (thus just as healthy as cooking everyday) but did it all at once instead of having to decide what to make each day, do the prep and cleanup each day, etc.
I often wonder/presume my ADHD (or something) counters my autism, in so far as it making the torture of the mess not present (as I imagine/observe in some autistic people). It also does not help with making a start on it. I don’t really see the mess, merely peripherally aware by deduction (so “wallowing” may have been misleading ~ it does not bother me, but I still feel the pressure from social expectation to do something about it (and that bothers me more ~ as well as contribute to the demand avoidance log-jam)). Things are where I put them, so I know where they are.
I’ve been trying for a couple years to get help tidying, since it has proven beyond my abilities; beyond several hurdles (and when I get past one [like physical ailments], I discover I’m still unable with more hurdles [like the executive dysfunction and demand avoidance]), but have so far failed at getting help too ([because, “hurdles”]) ~ or even getting someone to help me to get help. The aspiring idea being to hire a team to help, to get it all done at once, “rip the band-aid off”, rather than a prolonged suffering of some things moving, and not knowing where everything is, from the little bits of help here and there a rare few times from friends and family.
There’s a lot of little things that get taken care of, as necessity, to keep things functioning (like cleaning my blender jug and lid straight away, as part of the process of using it to make food ~ less demanding than later cleaning the dried goop left on it), but still “clutter” accumulates wherever else is not the minimum required spaces to do things. Much of it’s not really “clutter”, and more just the stuff I need around, preferring it kept at arm’s reach on the worktop, rather than out-of-sight-and-out-of-mind in cupboards that require extra effort (~ especially with the unreliable silly upwards opening cupboard doors I got left with here).
I had a visit from my uncle today (suspected fellow autistic ~ & mutually the relative we each get on best with in our family), who’s house is similarly chock-a-block “messy”. That’s a comfort. He’s even voiced his lack of concern about the mess, and how it feels at home for him, with his place “worse” with things being where he left them, in precarious piles all around, where one has to move carefully not to knock over. Much nicer than the (real or imagined) judgement of those who prefer this thing called “tidy” that I can barely conceive of (certainly not as they do), and who apparently find it easy to maintain that kind of “tidy” (which for the largest part I struggle to conceive of as anything other than making more work for themselves, with things they need “put away”, rather than on-hand).
When I got left here (about 5 years ago), the house was bare. And that in part left an unease. I felt more need to fill it with things, useful things (e.g. edible plants in the conservatory, tools and things for health), so that I would (and do) feel more at peace with the stuff, rather than everything unnervingly bare. … But I know there are some areas that have tipped the balance the other way, from comforting efficiency to impeding getting some stuff done. I sometimes wonder if some of it is subconscious intent to self sabotage, so I don’t have to do some of those things, since they lead me back to trauma triggering things and places (from when I was deeply betrayed and [(psychologically tortured by being)] denied autonomy while being promised it ~ long story).
Hopefully some parts of that ramble helped answer the original question a bit better now too.
Now since I’ve reminded myself… I’m likely going to go have some PTSD flashback “fun”. (Strong sarcasm ~ it’s not fun).
It’s just not doing anything until you’re so bored you kill yourself. Great idea.
LOL.
Alas, I have an internet connection, and know how to use it properly… So I’ll never be bored. ;)
I don’t know what this comment means? It is a personal reflection on an attempt to adopt it? Or a surface level flippant remark?
Gotta admit I laughed at your first thought. I can relate.
I dunno if I have a ‘low demand lifestyle’ but some things I do or think about that makes things easier:
- I have alarm for when it’s time to make lunch and dinner, which helps me relax or focus.
- I have an alarm for when it’s time to go to bed. Not necessarily sleep, but I use that time to wind down.
- I plan my days roughly in a calendar; sleep, lunch, dinner, gym time. How detailed I am depends on how integrated it is into my routine. When going to the gym, I don’t plan the time to walk there and home. But if I’m going on a family trip, I like to plan out in more detail.
- Routines and habits are more about doing things in the same order rather than the exact time every day.
- I order groceries every other week to the door. I still go to the grocery store 1-2 times a week tho but that’s mostly for veggies or stuff I forgot to order.
- If it’s worth doing, it’s worth doing halfway.*
- Actually use things that help me, like nose-canceling headphones and stimming toys.
- We live in an apartment complex with shared laundry room, so I try my best to book laundry same day every week, that way I don’t need to remember as hard as I have a laundry-day.
- I go to the gym on the same days every week as well. Those are my gym-days.
- We eat roughly the same things every day/week, I don’t like to plan my meals too much and prefer to just wing it. I build meals by deciding on: a protein, some veggies, a starch (aka. pasta, rice or potatoes). I make we eat veggies at least once a day and preferably more than just some chopped onion.
- Only wear comfy clothes. I absolutely refuse to wear anything that is uncomfortable in any way. It takes way to much energy.
- Make cleaning easier. You don’t need a special cleaning bottle for every area, with a special tool and everything color-coded etc. **
- I try to do some kitchen-cleaning every evening before bed. It has become a part of my going-to-bed routine. I also prep the coffee maker. If I’m going somewhere I prepare clothes for the next day, prepare breakfast and just as much as I can to make the morning easier.
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- Example: Say you need to do the dishes, but you only have energy for half of the dishes. If you only want to do everything or nothing. You’ll have to wait… while more dishes pile up. Needing more and more energy to do them all. In the end you are forced to use a lot more energy than you have to clean them all.
If you instead think it’s worth doing halfway, sure your kitchen might rarely be ✨Sparkling Clean✨ but your mental health and energy levels will be SO much better.
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** All you really need for cleaning your home:
- Bottle of all-cleaner, for most areas. Floors, dusting etc.
- I like to use dish-washing soap to clean the kitchen area, it’s good at removing fats and safe if you accidentally don’t rinse properly.
- A bad-ass oven cleaner, so you don’t have to scrub for eternity!
- Toilet cleaner, for the bowl. You can use all-cleaner for the rest of the toilet.
- Window / glass cleaner. Although, if you have good micro cloths you don’t even need that.
- A chalk-remover that you use when you get buildup from the water.
Tools:
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Micro-fiber cloths. There are different types and qualities.
- Smooth ones are good for glass and other shiny surfaces.
- Fluffy ones are good for all other areas, especially dusty or if it’s many germs as they “catch” the germs.
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I like to use dish-washing tools to clean the kitchen. ( I kinda have a lot woops )
- Sponge-cloth, a thin square “cloth” made from sponge, super absorbent and washable.
- Dish brush and/or sponge (non-scraching) and/or sponge with handle
- Fine soapy steel wool for those impossible spots
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Vacuum-cleaner (get one of those quiet ones, I can watch tv while using it, they are amazing.
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mop and bucket (not those flat ones)
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Nice to have
- “spot eraser” sponge, a white, dense sponge, great for removing spots on handles, light switches etc.
- “Edge brush”, like this: https://www.stadbutiken.se/sv/artiklar/smartbrush-komplett.html but you can also repurpose an old toothbrush.
- A broom-set, especially if you have pets or often get dirt on the floor so you don’t have to pull out your vacuum cleaner all the time.
- A rubber-broom to clean carpets with, especially if you have pets.
- If you want to be fancy you can skip the vacuum-cleaner and mop if you replace them with proper cleaning mop that cleaning-companies use, like this: https://www.stadbutiken.se/sv/artiklar/swep-extramopp-50cm-rod.html but they are expensive.
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Well that turned into a wall of text. Woops.
Different strokes for different folks.
Glad that’s working for you.
All those alarms and plans (and (perhaps also) the routines) would increase demand to me, causing a neuro traffic jam, grinding me to a halt in stress.
But the thing is, we all have routines as far as I know. Like what order we but on our clothes, or if we brush our teeth before or after that etc. All those things are routines. It doesn’t mean I have lists and steps for everything. It’s more that I block out rough time frames. Like, making and eating dinner usually takes around 1h 45min, so I plan for 2h to have some wiggle-room. Then I can move it around as much as I like, when needed. No problem. It’s also a gradual thing. I didn’t start with everything :)
But yeah, a few years ago, this would have felt super stressful for me too !
we all have routines
Yep. I was long time seeing advice from Ayurveda that, for my vata dosha, routines would really do me good, and I’d recoil from that, seeing routines only as those imposed (as demands) on me. Little did I realise I had indeed formed many routines of my own. (Hence why that was in brackets with a “perhaps”).
a few years ago, this would have felt super stressful for me too
I’m still mid-transition to accepting it. :) Making progress. Eliminating that stressor born of that conflation and negativity tainted perception.
aah I see, thanks for clarifying :)
I’m glad you are making progress!
This is such a helpful comment, thank you!
I’m going to add a few things here that I do a little differently just in case it is helpful to others who stumble across this thread, not to disagree with what you are sharing:
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eating the same things every day/week - like you mention it’s not exactly the same things but a collection of options. It saves me from getting too bored. I’ll make a big thing of beans/tofu/other legumes and rice and add a veggie to it each day, and try different sauces to jazz it up. I truly don’t understand how people make a whole dinner every day (my brother is like, it’s only 40 mins a day??? - sir I need to eat now lol)
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comfy clothes 💕💕💕I have a bare minimum standard of “office” clothes I maintain but they are typically jeans and a non-tshirt top. No “outfits” just things that work together . I change out of outdoor clothes (pants with waistbands/buttons, shirts that require me to sit a certain way to not expose cleave or midsection, and supportive undergarments) the moment I get home. Fuck having to position my body a certain way.
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I do keep “special” cleaning supplies in different areas. That way if I feel moved to clean I don’t need to find the stuff. It’s not so much different things but duplicates of common items like all purpose cleaner, brooms, mops. I have a two level home and this really helps.
Well, thank YOU! :)
Yes, to keep things where they are used makes it sooo much easier.
I also forgot to mention that I use Swiffers for dusting shelfs and stuff. Might not be the most effective, but they are good enough and makes dusting a lot easier
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For me personally, I find that every time I have to make a decision, that’s a demand. Low-demand, therefore, involves limiting the amount of decisions I need to make - pre-planned meals, a pre-curated selection of apps on your phone and/or PC, etc.
Oh yes, I feel that way also. Thank you for sharing.
I think when I was at my best I was doing these things. It was a coincidence that what I had going on in my life (specific sports) is what caused me to meal prep, have very regimented workout schedules, sleep times etc. But looking back it was probably self perpetuating: I didn’t have all these demands so I had the energy to do all the things and in turn ate better, slept better, took better care of my body all which increased my stamina.
I’ve been avoiding the regimented lifestyle thinking it would be more restful to just go off vibes and whims but this might be one of the problems.
I never really thought of it as “low-demand” but that’s a surpisingly practical way to phrase it, framing your decisions, lifestyle, and personal living spaces to be less mentally taxing and “economic” in that sense.
Broadly, it’s resembles minimalism but a significant balance with practicality rather than aesthetics (it’s a bonus). As other’s have said “less decisions and a readily achieved default state”. Some examples:
- Limited number of clothes that mix and match with one another. If I get new clothes, I’ll alway donate an equal amount to keep it limited.
- Schedule in general to reduced decisions but most helpful was meals and meal prepping.
- Bedroom and office have minimal furnishing/clutter so it’s easy to clean up and incredibly easy to return to that default state and peace of mind.
Laundry, cleaning, and errands become less demanding (less clothes, easy to clean) in that sense which leaves mental room to explore new ideas one at a time.
Thank you! I’ve been so resistant to scheduling things because I thought that would be easier and more free but turns out freeballing executive function is not something I can do lol
That’s good to hear (~read), and a little difficult to confront as a possibility for me too… looming schedules create very disruptive (even health harming) stress for me. But maybe I should consider finding a way that works for me. Because as is currently, that’s also not really “working”.
I reflected on this quite a bit this morning (unrelated to this thread specifically) and I think it’s the attachment to outcomes and tasks that makes this super stressful to me.
I think a lot of the looming schedule stress can be quelled if I can remove all the thinking about the steps of the tasks and the tasks that need to be complete are given actually realistic times for completion (which means doing way, way less than I would normally because everything takes me so much longer now).
In the past I would wake up and go to the gym before work and would basically throw myself out of the door. I knew how long the gym would take (because I was either training for a race and had set durations of run/swim or set weigh routines) and would then go to work. After work I either had another workout or I would work on a volunteer commitment that had extremely specific steps and timeframes or get my stuff ready for the next day and spend time with my partner. It didn’t always go perfectly, but I was way less stressed about my schedule being packed than I am now. I think a lot of that was due to how dialed in and consistent everything was, so there was no real worry about missing a step or being late. This point of my life had some struggles, but not nearly as bad as right now where there is so much less structure so any attempt at structure feels like a cage.
Not sure this would work for you, but sharing because I think that I am realizing that what felt like something that should be super stressful really wasn’t - and probably because it was so low demand as everything was planned out.
remove all the thinking
Oh and it is glorious, and very satisfying, when inspiration strikes and something just gets done.
I suspect a large part of that is due to neuro-chemical balance, mediated by the right vitamins, minerals, herbs, aromatherapy, sound therapy, environmental conditions, mood priming, etc, etc, etc.
how dialled in and consistent
I’ve oddly fought against to much of this, “preferring” more novelty, knowing how much more sensitive to change I get the more consistent things get. Kinda like keeping myself robust to change, with the neuroplasticity generated from the hormesis from novelty and lots of little changes and variety. … Though that in itself is fairly inconsistently applied. Some things like that, some things more reliably consistent. I found this helped me find more peaceful confidence in my ability to handle whatever curve balls were thrown at me in life. ~ At least, until the big one. Then I didn’t seem to have much choice about falling into a routine, and that atrophying, making changes (or even appointments) much (MUCH) more difficult to cope with again. Been dealing with coming out of an atrophied body. It takes a long time of gentle practice to start to see progress throughout the long dragged-out start. And then it accelerates. Much the same happens in our neurophysiology as in our muscles.
realizing that what felt like something that should be super stressful really wasn’t
And it’s a glorious thing to get there, past the tight claustrophobic/myopic feedback loops that make it seem worse than it is.
I’m not fully familiar with the phrase, but I generally try to set things up in my life so that things fall into place with or without further input from me. I’ve had (and have) a lot of problems with executive disorder in my life, so it’s always a gamble for me. One day I’ll be perfectly fine putting in ten hours of work furthering a single project, the next I can barely stand 30 minutes.
My way of managing this has been to look for “default states” as I call them. To try and find a way that if this is the last moment of attention and work I can put in to what I’m doing, things will still carry along to a positive or at least a neutral outcome.
It doesn’t always work, obviously there are some things out there that just defy that kind of approach. But when I can get it working for me it’s really nice because it allows me to take the brakes I need to avoid burnout without feeling guilty or gambling too much with the outcome of whatever it is I’m trying to do.
Good stuff.
Reading that alleviated a lot of pressure.
That sounds like that approach would better fit me too.
Accepting when can. Not imposing a rigid scheduled structure that I’m demanded to meet.
Oh wow I do need to figure out the “default states”. I’ll often push through something because I think I can finish it and it will be so much easier than coming back to it and having to remember all the steps/variables but that’s how I end up working 60 hour weeks 😬
Thank you!
I don’t go for low demand, but I reduce friction. Have to hurry to wash sheets and put them back on? Buy an extra set. Swap them, wash the previous ones at your own pace, no hurry.
Good example! I guess I do a lot of this kind of stuff already, which is nice to hear. Maybe the goal for me can be identifying when I am doing it and where there might be gaps.
I’m AuDHD so I’ve got multiples of most things LMAO (lose everything all the time).
Was the recommendation the broad “research this thing” or “you must adopt this”? Because it sounds like the therapist is having you look at your lifestyle to see if there are beneficial habits that can be built into your routine.
It feels like there are some details missing from the session: did the therapist cover the low demand lifestyle or put the research and details on you? Were you previously talking about anxiety or frustration throughout your day? I don’t want the details or answers but to highlight that your post was scant and set us up to disagree with the therapist. Therapists usually have a valid outside perspective and yours seems to think you will find success in how you manage and perform your habits.
