I had seen people paying for services to write research for them.
I had seen people translate research papers from foreign languages(Like Russian for example) to English to avoid doing any work.
And even much more methods were used in college.
The reality is people can’t seem to understand how broken are education systems and how science had flows that are only now brought to light and studied.
While AI made fraud more accessible for sure and made the problems worse, it’s only a sign of how much education were broken before it.
In my eyes, the last years put a bright spotlight on degrees worth that a lot of companies had started valuing them less and most probably the value of official degrees will keep falling down as the years pass by.
Just because there were ways to do it before does not mean they were as easy to use or as cheap as AI, and just because there are other ways to cheat doesn’t whataboutism clear away any criticism of the most notoriously popular method.
I don’t see how I could possibly cheat during my engineering studies. Every exams was different from previous years, you had to detail the calculation steps, you had to be so fluent with using the formulas and fast at calculating in order to even have a chance to answer all questions. Most exams were calibrated so that only the top students have just enough time to finish.
We are producing graduates who are good at solving trivial technical problems at breakneck speed. Meanwhile, back in reality, nothing of value is created quickly. Who would board a plane that had been designed like this? It would be disconcerting to hear from a doctor ‘I did your surgery as fast as possible’ when waking from a medical procedure.
Engineering and science is done slowly and meticulously because it is very difficult and takes years to become competent and decades to truly master.
It’s taught us to learn fast. Also, it’s made so that you can’t lean answers by heart, you need to understand what your doing to have a chance to solve the exams. You can’t succeed by being fast and mindless, you need to be optimal (maybe skip some questions strategically). I think it’s a good learning method for engineering, teachs you to be thorough and methodical.
Aren’t they just complaining about another form of cheating that is low-effort and low-cost. I don’t think people are complaining that there wasn’t cheating at all?
We had that Aunt Becky from Full House scandal not too long ago.
Hell man, when I was in uni we noticed all the software engineers did better than the computer science students. Well, guess what the software engineering students had? previous exams and stuff …
I definitely think that University/College or what-have-you is broken and has a bigger problem for sure though.
least for the US, it’s a direct consequence of the federal student aid process. a pipeline literally written by investment bankers to milk the american public for every $ they could instead of taxing rich people for the public good.
schools naturally want as much of this $ as they can as well so they lower standarda and just let anyone through, it’s not their problem if someone doesn’t learn anything
Canada isn’t as bad as the US in that regard but we have echoes of that. Universities didn’t know how to deal with more students and just crammed us in, raised the price, and didn’t care if we learned anything.
Just cause it was bad before doesn’t mean it’s not worse now. It’s a lot easier to use AI.
Yes and I mentioned it in my post.
What do “collage students” have to do with colleges and science education?
deleted by creator
They’re making a joke about a typo. I wouldn’t expect an actual answer from them.
Oh, I didn’t notice it. :)
Your title is wrong anyway. We had like 10% of cheaters before because it was hard to cheat, you could get caught, and there was some moral barrier to do that. Now, you only need a Google account to cheat, and I’m pretty sure that the rate of 50% of students cheating is pretty accurate.
how broken are education systems
Yes, but it’s not an excuse for that huge increase. There was way less cheating before, AI enabled it.
At least the previous cheating took effort. In all seriousness though, university was originally a system where a class was basically a book club directed by an expert. You went to class, discussed the reading, found out what to read for next time.
- going back to this format, plus tests that you take in class, with no grading of homework which was always stupid in the first place, would solve all the problems with cheating. It is also a better format for learning. Having lectures where students face to take notes in real time to have the material for the tests when it could just be in a book is absurd and massively inefficient
- but you’d have to have enough professors
- and professors would have to stop reusing tests
- going back to this format, plus tests that you take in class, with no grading of homework which was always stupid in the first place, would solve all the problems with cheating. It is also a better format for learning. Having lectures where students face to take notes in real time to have the material for the tests when it could just be in a book is absurd and massively inefficient
What the fuck is even the point of going to college if you don’t want to learn?
To get the degree. Because more and more companies won’t even interview you if you don’t have a degree, regardless of how much experience you have.
My friend has 23 years of experience in a career. Won industry awards. His job moved their offices to another state, he stayed. Even though he had contacts in the industry who wanted to hire him, once it was found out he didn’t have a degree, their HR depts wouldn’t let his contacts even interview him.
One person was a VP. A freakin’ VP of operations wasn’t allowed to hire him, because HR had a “No degree, then no chance” policy. She even advised him to go to WGU, and try to get one within 6 months, because that was as long as she could hold the job open for him.
The reason he never went earlier is because he was a single parent, and already was working in the industry. So he mistakenly thought that his experience would outweigh any degree. That used to be true, but not now.
A lot of people go to college specifically to get a decent job later on. Companies requiring college degrees for work that really shouldn’t are to blame, mostly.
Yep!
Degrees look impressive
Not being incompetent is more impressive!
Doesn’t pay the bills, though.
Social network tradition.
They say frats do their hazing as a way of extortion.
If everyone in college and university is getting easy degrees with AI and similar, why not just bypass the process and give everyone a Phd?
You get a Phd, OP.
I get a Phd.
Everyone on Lemmy gets a Phd.
We all get Phds!
Yaay!!
I gpt a phd, a pretty huge dick
/s
College is a failed business model
Failed how? It might not provide appropriate value to the customers, but it sure seems to turn a profit.
I had seen people paying for services to write research for them.
I had seen people translate research papers from foreign languages(Like Russian for example) to English to avoid doing any work.
What I see as the main distinction between these forms and AI-enabled cheating is that the university is at least accrediting someone’s scholarship (assuming it goes through the system just fine). AI/LLMs output pure, unverifiable, black-box gobbledygook in a way that gums up the whole system. I’m not associated with a university anymore but have several friends who do teach at that level and the amount of opaque muck they’re having to trawl through just to try to prove if a human wrote any bit of the essay they’ve been handed in makes me glad I didn’t pursue my own career in education further.
I agree with the gist of your argument, I really do, but I don’t think that the current gen of AI cheaters are just a new form of a forever problem in academia.
All the Dude ever wanted was a good “collage” upon his rug.
College is about accreditation instead of learning, so people will only put in the effort they need to become accredited rather than putting in the extra effort required to actually learn.
