Copyright can be a problem but they showed The Scream which isn’t copyrighted.
The rest is wrong. I’m not paying an illustrator to make a meme. I used Gimp for my last shitpost. I didn’t pay a professional oil painter.
The pollution claim is way off. You can run Stable Diffusion at home on your GPU for the same energy as playing a game.
No you do not have to embrace everything new. That’s not a counterpoint.
Jobs. See Gimp comment above. Photography put millions of hard working portrait painters out of business. The world ended in 1865, you just didn’t notice.
Using AI doesn’t need to be done on corporate hosts. You can run AI on a home built server.
My hand made art looks ugly. My Photoshopping is garbage.
Using AI is lazy. As is Photoshop. As is photography. You want human touch, hire an actual artist. Don’t digitize art because that uses electricity, is lazy, and puts artists out of work. Definitely don’t use lithography or other photo mechanical copying methods like printing presses. Hand draw each and every comic you distribute.
The argument AI fanboys make that it’s the same creative effort as directing or photography is absolutely insane and falls flat with even a tiny bit of critical thinking. Anyone can plug in a prompt. People study and work hard their entire lives to become good photographers and directors. Being able to take a decent picture is not the same AT ALL as a professional photographer, especially one of the successful ones, like all art. It takes incredible patience, timing, creativity, and technical knowledge. It’s an accessible art form, like most forms of art, but doing it at the highest level takes a lot of skill. You need to select and know a great deal about your subject in order to capture it well, and timing is often incredibly important. There are people that spend their entire professional lives pursuing one shot, and when they finally get it, the photo is priceless and nearly impossible to replicate. The idea that an art form people get degrees and spend years pursuing is the same as typing a prompt is crazy. Just because anyone can pick up a camera (or a pen, or a paintbrush, etc) does not make the art form that simple.
Directing is an art form too, and there’s a very good reason the art of great directors is immediately attributable to them on viewing, even with no context. Anyone making that argument has no idea what it means to direct. Just because some directors might be lazy or uncreative doesn’t mean the artform doesn’t exist. AI could never replace it.
Like I said I tried AI art once to see what it was about. I did not get anything good but I’ve seen AI art that looks good so I know it is possible with experience in prompting.
Getting the right prompts can be done by anyone in the same way anyone can take a photo. I expect people will spend time learning how to prompt in the same way people learn the knobs and lenses on their camera. Anyone can take a photo. It takes skill to take a good one. Anyone can generate an AI image but it takes skill (less skill but skill nonetheless) to create a good one.
The skill and knowledge to create an oil painting is several orders of magnitude greater than taking a photo. The only reason photography is defended is because everyone grew up with photography slop. Today phone cameras make it even more automated with their automated bokeh and red eye removal.
As somebody learning photography, take my goddamn hobby out of your mouth. I am so sick of you AI freaks pretending that chatgpt and photography are the same thing.
My hand made art looks ugly.
Practice, then. It’s good for you. All that brain activity from actually doing something with your life might stop the dementia from getting you in your 50s.
Have you painted landscapes and portraits? Take your goddamn machine generated hobby out of your mouth.
I’ve (attempted) painting (badly). I’ve done photography (successfully). I’m sick of photographers pretending it’s the same thing as oil on canvas.
The gap of effort and time between photography and painting is greater than AI and photography. I select a lens and turn some knobs on my camera that I know from experience work based on the subject (lighting conditions, motion, distance, effects) and press a button. No amount of skill with oil on canvas can produce art as quickly as using a camera.
I tried AI art once to see what it was about and it took a lot of time with prompts to get anything useful out.
I tried AI art once to see what it was about and it took a lot of time with prompts to get anything useful out.
So does passing a kidney stone.
I don’t care about effort, I want to know what you have to say. I want to see what you’ve learned. I want you to show me something about your life.
If this were math, I want you to show me your work.
In the things you’ve made, you are the only thing I give a shit about. You’ve made things with AI? Show me where you are in them, then. Are you even real? Do you exist? Should I care you were ever even here?
If you think photography doesn’t achieve these things, boy, let me tell you about AI then.
To onlookers: if you’re wondering why I’m not addressing the lazy and uninteresting hypocrisy arguments, it’s because they don’t mean anything.
Painters used to be mad at photographers? Okay. They get along now, why is that? Does anyone even care? Did they simply forget they were pissed at each other? Was Mercury in retrograde?
The only purpose of these arguments is to make you doubt yourself. They don’t advocate for anything. They don’t suggest a goal, or a resolution, or a compromise, they’re just rhetorical chess moves—“neener neener” and tongue wagging.
I don’t care about effort, I want to know what you have to say. I want to see what you’ve learned. I want you to show me something about your life.
Does that mean movie directors aren’t artists? Because all they do is prompt people into doing what’s in their mind until it’s either close enough or the actor does something unexpected and they keep it because it was better than their idea.
It should go to the actor yet often it’s the director who gets the Oscar without the actors also getting an Oscar despite improvisation on the set. Then there’s the entire crew of set design, artists, cinematographers, costuming, and who also do work based on loose prompts from the director. Sometimes they will be acknowledged along with the director but often the director gets an award without everyone else on the set also getting acknowledged.
The supposed beef between painters and photographers is weird, painters were often interested in photography so that they could continue paint the scene when the scene did no longer exist, it also opened up new areas for painters to explore, like impressionnism because an exact copy is kind of boring! Tedious work was offloaded onto the machine.
People use AI to create art, but not in the way that they just do a prompt and “hop” here is art! No, it’s just easier to ask the machine to generate scenery and stuff than walking around trying to find a suitable one (for example) to help out, to try to find that elusive thing you want to capture, and then you paint. For example.
Photography has also evolved into its own art form, maybe AI will too one say day, who knows?
People doesn’t seem, as you suggest, to understand what art is or what it’s all about. To be fair, it’s a complex subject, but having a machine generating something is always going to be just a tool, like the painters brush is one.
The key difference here between this and photography, though, is that photography only displaced painters. You can tell by looking whether something is a photograph or not. Usually.
AI is very good and will only get better. When the machine can replicate any style, any subject, 3,000 times a minute: what is left for people to even do? How will you ever know a person was there?
If these tools were built to be honest, such that you always knew when something was generated and when something wasn’t, I wouldn’t have nearly as much of a problem with it.
I’d argue that hyperrealism isn’t art in itself, I mean you just cosplay as a printer. It’s just technique.
An artist must know the tools of its trade, only then can he or she make art. If you only have one technique, then you can’t express yourself, because expressing yourself is to chose between all that you know and can do and select the techniques that expresses the thing you want to express.
Art is about expressing yourself, expressing something, AI will never take that away. The masters artworks won’t becone non-art just because a machine could paint similar paintings.
I also doesn’t subscribe to the idea that art must be appreciated by someone, I think you can make art all by yourself (it is of course nice to be appreciated, but it’s not an obligation, again IMO), so let that AI machine produce photographs and paintings all day long, it won’t stop my struggles producing, maybe one day, a honorable painting.
Yeah, this is because the only thing they believe in is the end product.
If you ask them whether they prefer a text from their real mom over a digital simulation of what their mom might say, they’ll acknowledge what you’re getting at, the human spirit, but they’ll call it a love bond. So, their mom has human spirit, but not their neighbors.
Copyright can be a problem but they showed The Scream which isn’t copyrighted.
The rest is wrong. I’m not paying an illustrator to make a meme. I used Gimp for my last shitpost. I didn’t pay a professional oil painter.
The pollution claim is way off. You can run Stable Diffusion at home on your GPU for the same energy as playing a game.
No you do not have to embrace everything new. That’s not a counterpoint.
Jobs. See Gimp comment above. Photography put millions of hard working portrait painters out of business. The world ended in 1865, you just didn’t notice.
Using AI doesn’t need to be done on corporate hosts. You can run AI on a home built server.
My hand made art looks ugly. My Photoshopping is garbage.
Using AI is lazy. As is Photoshop. As is photography. You want human touch, hire an actual artist. Don’t digitize art because that uses electricity, is lazy, and puts artists out of work. Definitely don’t use lithography or other photo mechanical copying methods like printing presses. Hand draw each and every comic you distribute.
The argument AI fanboys make that it’s the same creative effort as directing or photography is absolutely insane and falls flat with even a tiny bit of critical thinking. Anyone can plug in a prompt. People study and work hard their entire lives to become good photographers and directors. Being able to take a decent picture is not the same AT ALL as a professional photographer, especially one of the successful ones, like all art. It takes incredible patience, timing, creativity, and technical knowledge. It’s an accessible art form, like most forms of art, but doing it at the highest level takes a lot of skill. You need to select and know a great deal about your subject in order to capture it well, and timing is often incredibly important. There are people that spend their entire professional lives pursuing one shot, and when they finally get it, the photo is priceless and nearly impossible to replicate. The idea that an art form people get degrees and spend years pursuing is the same as typing a prompt is crazy. Just because anyone can pick up a camera (or a pen, or a paintbrush, etc) does not make the art form that simple.
Directing is an art form too, and there’s a very good reason the art of great directors is immediately attributable to them on viewing, even with no context. Anyone making that argument has no idea what it means to direct. Just because some directors might be lazy or uncreative doesn’t mean the artform doesn’t exist. AI could never replace it.
Like I said I tried AI art once to see what it was about. I did not get anything good but I’ve seen AI art that looks good so I know it is possible with experience in prompting.
Getting the right prompts can be done by anyone in the same way anyone can take a photo. I expect people will spend time learning how to prompt in the same way people learn the knobs and lenses on their camera. Anyone can take a photo. It takes skill to take a good one. Anyone can generate an AI image but it takes skill (less skill but skill nonetheless) to create a good one.
The skill and knowledge to create an oil painting is several orders of magnitude greater than taking a photo. The only reason photography is defended is because everyone grew up with photography slop. Today phone cameras make it even more automated with their automated bokeh and red eye removal.
As somebody learning photography, take my goddamn hobby out of your mouth. I am so sick of you AI freaks pretending that chatgpt and photography are the same thing.
Practice, then. It’s good for you. All that brain activity from actually doing something with your life might stop the dementia from getting you in your 50s.
Have you painted landscapes and portraits? Take your goddamn machine generated hobby out of your mouth.
I’ve (attempted) painting (badly). I’ve done photography (successfully). I’m sick of photographers pretending it’s the same thing as oil on canvas.
The gap of effort and time between photography and painting is greater than AI and photography. I select a lens and turn some knobs on my camera that I know from experience work based on the subject (lighting conditions, motion, distance, effects) and press a button. No amount of skill with oil on canvas can produce art as quickly as using a camera.
I tried AI art once to see what it was about and it took a lot of time with prompts to get anything useful out.
Yes.
So does passing a kidney stone.
I don’t care about effort, I want to know what you have to say. I want to see what you’ve learned. I want you to show me something about your life.
If this were math, I want you to show me your work.
In the things you’ve made, you are the only thing I give a shit about. You’ve made things with AI? Show me where you are in them, then. Are you even real? Do you exist? Should I care you were ever even here?
If you think photography doesn’t achieve these things, boy, let me tell you about AI then.
To onlookers: if you’re wondering why I’m not addressing the lazy and uninteresting hypocrisy arguments, it’s because they don’t mean anything.
Painters used to be mad at photographers? Okay. They get along now, why is that? Does anyone even care? Did they simply forget they were pissed at each other? Was Mercury in retrograde?
The only purpose of these arguments is to make you doubt yourself. They don’t advocate for anything. They don’t suggest a goal, or a resolution, or a compromise, they’re just rhetorical chess moves—“neener neener” and tongue wagging.
Does that mean movie directors aren’t artists? Because all they do is prompt people into doing what’s in their mind until it’s either close enough or the actor does something unexpected and they keep it because it was better than their idea.
Credit for this would go to the actor, Morpho.
I am intentionally leaving you room to impress me, and you are still just calling out alleged hypocrisy.
It should go to the actor yet often it’s the director who gets the Oscar without the actors also getting an Oscar despite improvisation on the set. Then there’s the entire crew of set design, artists, cinematographers, costuming, and who also do work based on loose prompts from the director. Sometimes they will be acknowledged along with the director but often the director gets an award without everyone else on the set also getting acknowledged.
The supposed beef between painters and photographers is weird, painters were often interested in photography so that they could continue paint the scene when the scene did no longer exist, it also opened up new areas for painters to explore, like impressionnism because an exact copy is kind of boring! Tedious work was offloaded onto the machine.
People use AI to create art, but not in the way that they just do a prompt and “hop” here is art! No, it’s just easier to ask the machine to generate scenery and stuff than walking around trying to find a suitable one (for example) to help out, to try to find that elusive thing you want to capture, and then you paint. For example.
Photography has also evolved into its own art form, maybe AI will too one
sayday, who knows?People doesn’t seem, as you suggest, to understand what art is or what it’s all about. To be fair, it’s a complex subject, but having a machine generating something is always going to be just a tool, like the painters brush is one.
One can hope.
The key difference here between this and photography, though, is that photography only displaced painters. You can tell by looking whether something is a photograph or not. Usually.
AI is very good and will only get better. When the machine can replicate any style, any subject, 3,000 times a minute: what is left for people to even do? How will you ever know a person was there?
If these tools were built to be honest, such that you always knew when something was generated and when something wasn’t, I wouldn’t have nearly as much of a problem with it.
I’d argue that hyperrealism isn’t art in itself, I mean you just cosplay as a printer. It’s just technique.
An artist must know the tools of its trade, only then can he or she make art. If you only have one technique, then you can’t express yourself, because expressing yourself is to chose between all that you know and can do and select the techniques that expresses the thing you want to express.
Art is about expressing yourself, expressing something, AI will never take that away. The masters artworks won’t becone non-art just because a machine could paint similar paintings.
I also doesn’t subscribe to the idea that art must be appreciated by someone, I think you can make art all by yourself (it is of course nice to be appreciated, but it’s not an obligation, again IMO), so let that AI machine produce photographs and paintings all day long, it won’t stop my struggles producing, maybe one day, a honorable painting.
Exactly. Don’t cheat and use a machine like a camera.
They (tge one you responded to) also think painting and photographing is the same thing it seems.
Yeah, this is because the only thing they believe in is the end product.
If you ask them whether they prefer a text from their real mom over a digital simulation of what their mom might say, they’ll acknowledge what you’re getting at, the human spirit, but they’ll call it a love bond. So, their mom has human spirit, but not their neighbors.
“Using AI is lazy. As is Photoshop. As is photography. You want human touch, hire an actual artist.”