The more things change the more they stay the same
OP can you add her statement saying she misspoke?
I fumbled this line, plane and simple. To be clear, my foreign policy priority is ending Israel’s occupation, apartheid, and genocide in Palestine. I also reject the notion that anti-Zionism is antisemitism, and it’s important that we distinguish the two in order to combat actual antisemitism. I have always been opposed to any form of ethno-supremacy, and I refuse to vote for any of our tax dollars to go to any government that discriminates on that basis. I was being asked about rising antisemitism in this interview, and I was trying to say that my concern is while voters across the political spectrum wake up to Israel’s atrocities and our government’s complicity in it, the Democratic Party is failing to meet this moment. And when the Party refuses to lead morally on this issue, they are letting antisemites on the right co-opt the movement for Palestinian liberation while giving fodder to AIPAC talking points. But Sana is right, a movement for liberation must center the Palestinians being oppressed, occupied, and systematically exterminated — and the islamophobia and anti-Palestinian racism used to justify genocide is too often ignored. source
Why add context when you can be mad instead?
She didn’t misspeak, this is how 2 faced politicians straddle both sides of the line. She’s trying to do damage control. Everyone sees the interview and a handful see the apology
Exactly, she’s a politician.
She took a pause thinking about it and weighing her words before that sentence.
It didn’t just come out like that.
IDK that woman but her whole vibe feels fake AF.After rereviewing the interview and statement, I agree that even if this was an honest mistake, her retraction was not enough. She did not speak her implied two-state solution, which is unacceptable.
It’s called a consequence
She makes an excellent point that an opening is being made on the left that’s backdooring some truly horrible influencers into the hearts and minds of otherwise good people.
However the suggestion that we need to reach out to Zionists to mend that hole is… well it’s nuts really.
There’s a growing convergence out there and we should embrace it. People traditionally on the left and right of a two-party system that’s been largely aligned in its support for evil are finally realising that there’s a lot of things we agree on that’re not supported by either party. The only way we get those things is to break the hold the old guard has on us.
There is this political maneuver that is being embraced by DSA politicians that is preparing for the inevitable right wing anti Zionist candidate (like Tucker Carlson).
They seem to be attempting to move to the “we want to understand and listen to everyone”. It’s a fucking trap and will be absolutely destroyed by the “what’s going on?” Propaganda from Tucker and Candice.
It’s liberalism to the core and it will be seen as weak political pandering in a 2028 world in which Americans are blaming Israel entirely for the material decline.
The answer is NOT to talk to Zionist. The answer is to truly connect the Zionist interest to the interest of our ruling capitalist class. Fuck listening to Zionist. I’m sorry, you’re not reaching out to the Jewish community.
The American Jewish community is disconnecting itself from Israel more and more each day. Especially among the younger generation. You LEAD this change. You don’t follow it.
Disconnect Jewish identity from Zionism. Ignore the Jewish Zionist saying they “don’t feel heard”. Fuck them. They are Nazis the same as the Christian Zionist. Stop treating a Jewish Zionist as something special that you don’t do for the larger population of Christian Zionist. Stop treating them with kiddie gloves.
Disconnect from Zionist. They are modern day Nazis.
Fight the right on the material concerns of the working class. Fight the Tuckers on their class interest. Don’t make the 2028 election about the US being “controlled by Israel”. We will lose that fight. We will lose because we are not addressing the full contradictions of capitalism. And the far right is significantly better at lying to avoid contradictions. We can’t do that.
If we are going to win we HAVE to abandon this liberal idealism around “hearing people” that are our enemies. Fuck Zionist.
I can hear it already “now is the time for healing, we need to reach across the fence and unify etc” we all know this is how it always ends
*kid gloves
As in gloves made of kid leather.
Not kiddie gloves.
BTW, goatskin gloves are the best work gloves. Thin goatskin gloves last far longer than thick cowhide gloves. Those goats have really tough skin. They are well worth the extra cost.
They are also supposed to contain natural lanolin, which makes your skin softer. I never really noticed that making a difference. Probably just a marketing ploy to get women to buy them.
You know, I never really wear gloves when I work so I never really looked into it, but you made me want to buy a good pair of goat skin gloves!
I always wear work gloves in the yard. Too many ways to get cut, stabbed, scraped, splintered, burned, etc.
When I started studying as a cabinetmaker I was warned that gloves could get caught in the machines and now 20 years later my hands are just very callused and I rarely see a reason to wear gloves at all. Although last year when I was pruning rose bushes I definitely got properly stabbed and saw a reason to wear gloves.
To be clear, this is not DSAs line, these are Democrat acting opportunistically within the electoralist faction of DSA.
Edit: She has made a statement saying she mispoke
I fumbled this line, plane and simple. To be clear, my foreign policy priority is ending Israel’s occupation, apartheid, and genocide in Palestine. I also reject the notion that anti-Zionism is antisemitism, and it’s important that we distinguish the two in order to combat actual antisemitism. I have always been opposed to any form of ethno-supremacy, and I refuse to vote for any of our tax dollars to go to any government that discriminates on that basis. I was being asked about rising antisemitism in this interview, and I was trying to say that my concern is while voters across the political spectrum wake up to Israel’s atrocities and our government’s complicity in it, the Democratic Party is failing to meet this moment. And when the Party refuses to lead morally on this issue, they are letting antisemites on the right co-opt the movement for Palestinian liberation while giving fodder to AIPAC talking points. But Sana is right, a movement for liberation must center the Palestinians being oppressed, occupied, and systematically exterminated — and the islamophobia and anti-Palestinian racism used to justify genocide is too often ignored. source
Thank you for her statement on it. I still get red flags from it though and will continue to push politicians to the left.
My position is that all people that still proclaim they are Zionist or “willing to speak with Zionist” should be viewed the same as we have, historically at least, viewed Nazis. They should be not be a part of any political conversation. And anyone that attempts to connect broadly the “concerns” of Jewish Americans with Israel should be condemned and removed from political office. And this goes for Jewish Americans that use their Jewish identity as a shield to support Israel. Though it is often most used by Christian Zionist.
I am willing to “talk with” people that do not have this hard of a stance. I am not willing to talk with people that proclaim they are Zionist or “liberal zionist” or whatever. There is no more discussion to be had with them that does not just attempt to keep their ideas of Jewish supremacy alive and normalized.
We are not at that point yet. I realize that. But, until we are, I will continue to unapologetically criticize anyone that yeilds any ground to these Zionist framing or normalizations. This means I’ll criticize “good people” sometimes and that is entirely fine.
Yeah, its a really weird mashup of:
“too much of the mainstream rhetoric around liberation for Palestine and anti-zionism is coming from Nazis who just hate jews” (True!)
and
“so actually what we need to do is listen to the Zionist community and hear their perspectives”Which uhhhh, one of those things is a very good point to be making. The other is bewildering, get the fuck out of here with that. “We should listen to people who subscribe to this particular brand of ethno-nationalism, who will hear their voices? We only listen to the domestic ethno-nationalists, what about the ethnic nationalists who represent people abroad??”
We say fuck nazis and we can also say fuck zionists!
These are NOT mutually exclusive.
The “horrible influences” you mention are very real. Just recently I finally got round to blocking lemmy.ml. I always kept them around because I do value breaking into other echo chambers a bit to see things from their point of view.
They recently had a video posted, hosted on X, with claims that Israel conspired with Morocco to release migrants into Ceuta. The X post itself was filled with antisemitism. And I meant full-blown antisemitism, like Jewish caricatures, Nazi-rhetoric, not the “antizionism = antisemitism” kind.
I commented that I felt a bit uneasy taking a completely context-less video, blaming what’s happening on a “Jewish conspiracy” (that’s how it was being phrased) and simultaneously fully going along with far-right talking points (that Europe is being “invaded” (despite 95%+ migrants already having returned because Ceuta is not in Shengen) and that “Jewish elites” are conspiring to replace Christians with Muslims (great replacement theory but even stupider I guess)). Not to mention the total lack of class solidarity with the migrants.
Comment was upvotes +16 last I checked, but then got removed and I got banned for “zionism” (despite very clearly expressing my disdain for Israel and its genocide in that same comment). Antizionism must be kept separate from antisemitic influences, or Israel will use it to dismiss critics and justify their genocide. That .ml has apparently failed to do this is not something I wish to tolerate.
Link the post
https://lemmy.ml/post/50777620 Just look at the vile shit being posted on Twatter below that video.
Weirdly despite the mod removing my comment, my original comment isn’t visible in the modlog; that only shows a ban. I assume I must be ignorant of how the modlog works, but previously I could view the contents of my comment there too. Did they change that or did they mess with the modlog?
X is full of call for violence and hate speech towards all people , nothing surprising here. My guess is that your comment sounded it like people can’t say Israel control this , Israel conspired to have does that because it sound similar to real antisemite rhetoric towards jews but the different we have zero evidence of all the antisemitic bullshit about jews but he have ton of historical example of israel or it’s lobbies doing terrible things in secret . We saw how all mainstream media keep defending israel, it can’t be coincidence , we saw bbc removing 2 documentaries about the suffering in gaza after the lobby outrage , we have evidence of israel doing false flags operations. Regarding this particular event. Ynet has proven to push the israeli government framing and they wrote an article literally about this
Alongside the paid-for articles, Ynet also published promotional videos produced by the Ministry of Strategic Affairs, as well as three interviews with a ranking official at the ministry, Tzahi Gabrieli. Two of those paid-for interviews were conducted by Ynet’s senior political correspondent, Attila Somfalvi, who asked soft-ball questions that allowed him to present his talking points. From +972 magazine
Abraham Accords reach the Strait: how Israel can help Morocco reclaim its north
All I said was that we have no context on the video (is Morocco transporting migrants or did they intercept a transport, the exact opposite of the narrative presented? Since this appears to be in the middle of nowhere). Morocco generally has good relations with Spain when it comes to taking migrants back (by the end of the day the vast majority had already returned).
Then I mentioned we had zero evidence presented that Israel is involved. The “strongest” evidence presented is a couple tweets from Netanyahu’s son from 7 years ago. Not very compelling imo, especially given the evidence for completely different reasons for this migration wave, that Sanchez also gave.
Then I highlighted how this narrative was playing directly into the right’s hand, by having the left agree that “migrants are invading Europe” which in the Ceuta case is ridiculous by itself since it isn’t a Shengen area. And I pointed the genuine, unadulterated antisemitism under those tweets, “Jews control the world”-type shit (and worse).
I never disputed that Israel does shady shit, nor that it is a disgusting genocidal state. But apparently that’s “zionism” according to “.ml”.
So you simply ignore all what i said on why israel is involved?
The right exploiting an event is not a reason to reject evidence of that event it is so ridiculous. It like also saying people should not oppose isis becsuse the right could use it to say all muslims are terrorists and a dsnger to the western world
But what evidence is there of Israel paying off the king of Morocco to have the Moroccan army send migrants to the border of Ceuta? Because that’s the alleged conspiracy here. One video without context which could very well be demonstrating the opposite, that’s it. In the original now-removed comment I even explained why it’d be strange for Morocco to be involved like this.
I’m not saying that Israel never pulls shady shit; they obviously do (gotta complete a genocide, hard to do without shady shit). The point is that in this case the right uses this to attack innocent third parties who genuinely have nothing to do with this. It’s not a reason to reject evidence, it’s a reason to be careful with random conspiracy theories that conveniently (and falsely) validate some of the right’s main talking points.
If there was actual evidence presented that Israel is involved with this incident, then we should by all means share and publicly accuse. But no such evidence has been presented. I’m not rejecting evidence, I’m stating it doesn’t even exist in the first place, or rather isn’t being presented here. But I’m not going to go along with a random “jewish conspiracy to ethnically replace christians with muslims” on a whim.
deleted by creator
She literally used the rhetoric what make people gravitate to tucker.
the full interview is here, fyi: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gs3rR0J4oHg
Not losing support fast enough if you ask me. I can’t figure out why anyone here supports them.
Evangelical Christianity. They teach that once all the Jews are in Israel and Israel is destroyed in WWIII all ‘good Christians’ will rapture to Heaven.
Way, way too many people in high places unironically believe this shit. It’s why Biden was so supportive of Israel.
No , biden support for israel is purely imperialistic
I used to think so, but no, turns out he’s one of the nuts that thinks he’ll be raptured.
Biden is catholic not evangelical, he do not believe in the rapture.
What? Rapture is just a step of the apocalypse in Revelation. Catholics very much believe in all of that.
Different sect has different view on how the end of time would happen
Catholic source reject the rapture https://www.catholic.com/tract/the-rapture
The rapture doctrine was invented in the 1830s and is pretty exclusively held by American Evangelicals.
Despite being in DSA, she is explicitly speaking against DSAs ratified anti-Zionist line and in no way represents the org.
Edit: She has made a statement saying she mispoke
I fumbled this line, plane and simple. To be clear, my foreign policy priority is ending Israel’s occupation, apartheid, and genocide in Palestine. I also reject the notion that anti-Zionism is antisemitism, and it’s important that we distinguish the two in order to combat actual antisemitism. I have always been opposed to any form of ethno-supremacy, and I refuse to vote for any of our tax dollars to go to any government that discriminates on that basis. I was being asked about rising antisemitism in this interview, and I was trying to say that my concern is while voters across the political spectrum wake up to Israel’s atrocities and our government’s complicity in it, the Democratic Party is failing to meet this moment. And when the Party refuses to lead morally on this issue, they are letting antisemites on the right co-opt the movement for Palestinian liberation while giving fodder to AIPAC talking points. But Sana is right, a movement for liberation must center the Palestinians being oppressed, occupied, and systematically exterminated — and the islamophobia and anti-Palestinian racism used to justify genocide is too often ignored. source
That being said, she did not speak against her implied two-state solution and it’s still unacceptable.
She’s an op
Claiming to represent a progressive movement at home while pledging support for a fascist, apartheid ethnostate abroad.
That perfectly describes the Democrat Party in the last 4 decades.
Fascism Lite, with replacement authoritarianism created as a concentrate in a lab.
No space in dsa for zionists
Girl what?
I just hate foreign influence in domestic politics, from any country.
Me too, but all the way down the chain. It shouldn’t be legal for outsiders to funnel money into a state, city or town where they aren’t personally eligible to vote. Leave other people’s politics alone.
Maybe don’t genocide?
A position that I’ve literally had gagged on me before is that “I don’t hate Jews. I hate THOSE Jews specifically BECAUSE they are committing a genocide AND trying to start WW3.”
Yes…disliking someone based on their actions is legitimate, disliking someone because they are part of a specific ethnic/religious group is not.
exactly. Some of my favorite people are jewish! John Stewart, Mel Brooks, Bernie Sanders, Sarah Silverman, Fran Drescher, Volodymyr Zelensky, All of them are fantastic people!
That level of thinking is deeper than people want to do now, if they’re even still capable of it. The dominant process is to take in minimal information, decide who gets a black hat or white hat as quickly as possible, scroll to the next item, repeat.
It’s valid. Kind of like…“I don’t hate those ten guys who are very similar, I just hate that one guy from those ten who keep stabbing people in the neck”.
Scum, fuck her. She is making tucker even more popular with her bullshit
Is that concerning?
Fuck Israel, genocidal scum!
